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Thread: The internal debate continues

  1. #1
    Member Defiant1's Avatar
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    The internal debate continues

    Can you fellow reviteers help me with an ongoing debate?

    In our regular staff meetings, I constantly hear others advocating the use of in place families.
    I'm of the opinion that in place families should be used on a VERY limited basis.
    I never use them. Ever.

    Can you guys give me your opinions please?
    My position is primarily based on what I've read here. I consider it high value.
    Others, because they've found information on the wiki - insist it's "acceptable workflow" and consider my position as "based soley on the opinions of others". And it is...but those "others" (this forum) are very experienced.

    I fully understand their use is ok if "limited". But I don't believe for an instant that it's ok to go nuts using in place stuff everywhere.

    So - what's your take?

    Thanks in advance!

  2. #2
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    dzatto's Avatar
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    I can't remember the last time I used one. I personally don't like them. I'm sure there's a time and place that they need to be used, but I haven't come across it yet. Yes, I've used them before (when I first started), but quickly realized it's not the best way to do things. I'd much rather create a quick family, even if I didn't save it (just loaded it into the project).

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    The best argument I've heard regarding when to use in-place families is when it is a one-off custom item that needs the surrounding context to aid in it's development. The example given was a set of casework on a curved wall specific to that given project. Beyond that, I don't have sufficient experience to justify either. The project I'm working on has a few: custom casework in the cafe and the sanctuary platform, but even these I would anticipate evolving into more regular components/objects as the design develops.

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    Senior Member rkitect's Avatar
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    I come across this a lot in our office. We have some designers who do a lot of one-off design components specifically for a client or project. For those instances I find in-place models OK, especially maybe in a DD phase. However, sometimes it turns out that one-off object needs to be parametric ("Can we see what that looks like if it were 5' tall instead of 3?.. ok, now how about 4' 8.75" instead of 5?... ok what if we..." <--tru story). I have an acquaintance with a rather successful office using revit and he uses MIP all over the place, so I think what it comes down to is what the workflow dictates. Some projects it could be more useful than others.

  5. #5
    BIM there, done that cliff collins's Avatar
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    It is recommended by Autodesk to NOT use a large quantity of in-place families, as model performance will suffer.

    http://images.autodesk.com/adsk/file..._tech_note.pdf

    There is actually a way to create a model in-place, and then save it out as a family into your folder structure and then load it back into the project:
    What Revit Wants: Save an In-Place Family as an RFA for use in another project

    The argument for using in-place families, 9 out of 10 times is that the user "needs the surrounding context" to create the geometry inside the project.
    I have seen the use of cadd exports from the model, then imported into the family for "context", then deleting the cadd, and loading the family into the project.
    This can work, but just be careful to clean out all the .dwg files!

  6. #6
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    First of all, their argument logic is incorrect. A wiki is based in the opinions of others. This means that both sides are subject to the opinion of others.
    In-place elements add more weight to a project and lack utility. As others have stated, they should be used in very special circumstances. Component families are transferable, adaptable, and easier to place. Ask your team what their process is to use that element in another project? I bet it is some copy/paste bs.
    With type catalogs and component families, why would even want to use in-place elements.

  7. #7
    Senior Member rkitect's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by teeseeuu View Post
    why would even want to use in-place elements.
    As the image says: Click image for larger version. 

Name:	MIP.png 
Views:	104 
Size:	135.6 KB 
ID:	11747

  8. #8
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    Fair enough. There is a time and place for them, and this might be one. However, a fascia profile would work, right?

  9. #9
    Senior Member rkitect's Avatar
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    On a roof, yes, but this is a gable end wall rising above the roof. Are there other ways to do it? Perhaps.

  10. #10
    Member Darryl_S's Avatar
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    You could drop a model line on the gable edge and then host a fascia on that. At least then the profile is changeable across the project.

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