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Thread: Looking for a Term and an Example

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    Looking for a Term and an Example

    I'm introducing a small MEP company to the world of BIM and Revit. I'm looking for a type of document and not sure what it is called. It might be a LOD matrix but the ones that I am finding lack a bit of information that I've seen for piping. It included a statement about not modeling/coordinating pipes smaller than a specific size for certain systems. In other words, as MEP designers, we would model pipes larger than the stated size and could use place holders for the final branches going to fixtures so as to not cause clashes/interferences during analysis.

    I just need an example of this for a presentation.

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    Member TFuller's Avatar
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    BIM Execution Plan - here's a quick google result...

    https://vdcscorecard.stanford.edu/si...guide-v2.0.pdf
    Last edited by TFuller; January 7th, 2019 at 04:49 PM.

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    Thanks for that TFuller. It's way more than I was asking about but I've added it to my references for future use.

    I've seen a few versions of the document that I mentioned. It's very similar to a LOD matrix. I'll try some more searching using BIM Execution Plan to see what that yields.

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    It could be found in the BEP/BxP or referenced to a LOD Matrix/Specification etc from the BEP/BxP.

    Depending on what your role is, Design Engineering vs Sub Contractor will depend on what you would model.

    Some standards that would support certain sizes:
    University of Southern California - model geometry > 3/4" for pipes.
    USACE-M3 - model geometry > 1 1/2" for M and E services.

    I was expecting more standards to spell it out, but it looks like it's left up to the design teams to figure out.

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    Forum Co-Founder Twiceroadsfool's Avatar
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    More standards SHOULD spell it out, but (it appears) people are actually quite intimidated to "say what they need, and why, and then own it." So they prefer to just pass the buck. This screenshot says 1", from our standards. Its what i typically recommend A/C firms "require" from Engineers, although we prefer 3/4", obviously.

    Our written standard says 1", though, since most of our jobs have subcontractors that model down to greater level of detail when their scope of work starts, anyway.

    EDIT: Forgot the screen shot.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 2019-01-07_11-38-38.png  

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    Quote Originally Posted by Twiceroadsfool View Post
    More standards SHOULD spell it out, but (it appears) people are actually quite intimidated to "say what they need, and why, and then own it." So they prefer to just pass the buck. This screenshot says 1", from our standards. Its what i typically recommend A/C firms "require" from Engineers, although we prefer 3/4", obviously.

    Our written standard says 1", though, since most of our jobs have subcontractors that model down to greater level of detail when their scope of work starts, anyway.

    EDIT: Forgot the screen shot.
    Maybe I'm missing a piece of the puzzle from the standards I pulled, but if I was a major facility or organization (like these standards were pulled from) I wouldn't be leaving it up to the design team/contractor to tell me what I need. I'm sure some groups out there are getting better.

    I have a similar setup... matrix references to a dictionary/spec. A mashup of the BIM Forum LOD spec. It allows for each phase to have one LOD # (which no one wants to hear, god forbid if CD's are LOD 300 for all elements across the board) and then you define the requirements for each type of element. Super simple and removes ambiguity.

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    I dont list out "different requirements" for each LOD, as it just creates a crapload of paper. I have "The requirements for Millwork," and some of those requirements are Required by Design Development, some are Required by Construction Documents, and some are Required in Validation (as builts, not by design team).

    Some folks say its the *same thing,* but (to me) the simple difference of not making people jump back and forth between LOD 100 and LOD 200 and LOD 300 is enough to make it worth it. LOD sucks.

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    LOD is a shorthand created by people who didn't want to list out all the requirements for millwork. LOD isn't nearly as all encompassing as some make it out to be.

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    You've really got me at a loss here. I have no idea what you mean.

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    Saying LOD 300 doesn't tell you quite enough about how, for example, a door should be modeled and what it needs to report. It's not bad but it's not enough and leaves a ton open to interpretation.

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