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Thread: Revit + Signage Packages. Thoughts?

  1. #11
    Forum Addict GMcDowellJr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Twiceroadsfool View Post
    Yeah. Ive been there. Many many firms ago, we used ArchiTxt in Revit, or whatever the TTF variant of it was called.

    JMVHO, but i wouldnt ever embark on doing more than perspective signage information (schedules) without having the correct font. You start doing them with a substitute font, and then you get in to when things dont really fit on the signs, or when some letters are larger than others, and so on. I would pick a direction:

    1. Just schedules and information (and show all signs blank in model)
    2. If you want to show it on the signs, play the font game.
    Agreed. We don't show the fonts on the signs. We do show a solid of where the text will go but typically no words.

  2. #12
    Forum Addict GMcDowellJr's Avatar
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    Showing the actual text in the model is challenging outside of the licensing issues.

    Text on door signs are pretty small for Revit and, as such, the text gets heavily degraded (or did, I haven't looked in years... and if it doesn't then the rest of this is a waste of time <grin>). I ended up using a whole series of nested families (including at least one Planting family to scale the text) to get mine to work... and it's hacky as hell -- you have to tell the family what the proportions of the letters are (which doesn't even sound right in retrospect) as well as which lines had descenders (the part that sticks down below the baseline). I mean it works... in theory but I certainly wouldn't build from it -- images, sure but not shops.

  3. #13
    Administrator Twiceroadsfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GMcDowellJr View Post
    Showing the actual text in the model is challenging outside of the licensing issues.

    Text on door signs are pretty small for Revit and, as such, the text gets heavily degraded (or did, I haven't looked in years... and if it doesn't then the rest of this is a waste of time <grin>). I ended up using a whole series of nested families (including at least one Planting family to scale the text) to get mine to work... and it's hacky as hell -- you have to tell the family what the proportions of the letters are (which doesn't even sound right in retrospect) as well as which lines had descenders (the part that sticks down below the baseline). I mean it works... in theory but I certainly wouldn't build from it -- images, sure but not shops.
    Somewhat agreed. I dont typically want to see it in the actual model, simply because theres no way to actually do it short of Model Text, which just means a billion faces in the model, for all of the letters. And yeah, at small scales they DO get screwy. But, i dont mind having them in there, so SOMEONE can do a blow up of one sign, and show it all correctly. Trouble is, then it still has to be done right, with fonts, etc.

    So i assume do it, but then have all the geometry turned off in every instance except one thats used in a Live Legend View somewhere. And POSSIBLE turned on for some sort of psychotic walkthrough, but nothing that can zoom in on them, LMAO.

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    P I M P S M A C K !?!

    never heard that one.

  5. #15
    Mr. Revit OpEd
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    Isn't the horse out of the barn already if they are doing the signage in Illustrator with the required fonts?

  6. #16
    Administrator Twiceroadsfool's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Steve_Stafford View Post
    Isn't the horse out of the barn already if they are doing the signage in Illustrator with the required fonts?
    Possibly, but not certainly. Illustrator (Adobe suite in general) i find is MUCH less likely to be on *all* computers, even with Creative Cloud. So there are *coveted* seats, or "special people" who have them, and yeah... maybe THEY have those fonts rolled out. But i find those machines dont match the company *standard* a lot of the time.

    But thats just one dudes perception.

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    I decided to investigate this a little further and came acrosss this:

    Generally, copyright law in the U.S. does not protect typefaces.

    Fonts may be protected as long as the font qualifies as computer software or a program (and in fact, most fonts are programs or software).

    Bitmapped fonts are considered to be computerized representations of a typeface (and are not protected by copyright law).

    On the other hand, scalable fonts (because they are incorporated as part of a program or software) are protected by copyright.

    This means that copyright law (at least in the U.S.) protects only the font software, not the artistic design of the typeface.


    I got this from an article on typeface/font copyright on Crowdspring, so I'm not sure how accurate this is...

    It seems to be a little different in the UK:

    In the United Kingdom, the Copyright Designs & Patents Act 1988 specifically allows the use of fonts without infringing copyright.

    54 Use of typeface in ordinary course of printing.
    (1) It is not an infringement of copyright in an artistic work consisting of the design of a typeface
    (a) to use the typeface in the ordinary course of typing, composing text, typesetting or printing,
    (b) to possess an article for the purpose of such use, or
    (c) to do anything in relation to material produced by such use;
    and this is so notwithstanding that an article is used which is an infringing copy of the work.


    However you do commit an offence if you don't get the correct licence for the font in the first place. You need the right licence to create the copies of the fonts you intend to use: perhaps a straightforward TTF file, maybe a web-font version or something else.

    17 Infringement of copyright by copying.
    (1) The copying of the work is an act restricted by the copyright in every description of copyright work; and references in this Part to copying and copies shall be construed as follows.
    (2) Copying in relation to a literary, dramatic, musical or artistic work means reproducing the work in any material form. This includes storing the work in any medium by electronic means.
    Last edited by john.warburton; January 14th, 2020 at 07:13 AM.

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    The above is relevant for some things that I am working on. For example fire escape signage on a project where the Team want the drawings to show what the signs will look like both on plan (2D symbols) and in 3D models with lighting.

    Also for a road signage family, CAD and image library that I am working on. I am working on the principle that having purchased the Transport fonts for these, I satisfy the copyright requirements!

  9. #19
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    This is what my fire escape signs look like. Here in Holland at least you need those icons on the floorplan and those are the same as what is supposed to be on the actual signs as well. No text in there so no problem with fonts and text getting wonky when the size is to small.

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